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*Shrug* What else are you going to spend them on? None of the other skills are going to be any more useful.
That said part of the problem I m seeing with Occult is that the WoD is filled with bizarro monsters and things, and having one skill be the end-all-be-all of knowledge seems to kind of gross. Nondetection Cloak At 10 th level an occult slayer is able to cloak themselves from magical detection once per day as if by the Nondetection spell PHB, pg 263.
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[Hunter: the Vigil] High Occult/Possible Problem Character (1 Viewer)
*Shrug* What else are you going to spend them on? None of the other skills are going to be any more useful.
So all skills in the games you run are worthless? Ooookayyy.Delirium
Va, Gioca!
Validated User None of the other skills are going to be any more useful.Your Hunter games must be quite extraordinary.
macd21
Validated User
Validated User Sure they will.Why? They have a better chance of success - same as Occult 4 will have a better chance of success than Drive 4. In fact I'd say that Occult 4 is a far more useful investment of skill points as than Drive (which rarely comes into play in any game I've played in or run).
Yes, it's true that higher combat skill have clear benefits, as you clearly cause more damage. However the difference between Firearms 1 and 4 equates to about 1 point of damage, so it isn't a huge increase.
macd21
Validated User
Validated User So all skills in the games you run are worthless? Ooookayyy.
Not at all. All of the skills are useful (some admittedly a little moreso than others). But none are game-breakers, occult included. In my games a character with Occult 4 is useful to have around. A character with Firearms 4 is useful to have around. A character with Medicine 4 is useful to have around. But a character with Firearms 4 is only going to do a little more damage with each attack. Someone with Medicine 4 will be a bit better at patching up wounds. Someone with Occult 4 will know about more supernatural myths and legends. I contend that Occult 4 =/= knowledge of the Vampire Covenants, the Uratha Tribes, the Mage Orders. Occult 4 = folklore about vampires, mages, werewolves and others.
San Dee Jota
Validated User
Validated UserBut basically making Occult a collection of trivia from folklore and new-age isles? That's kinda crap. It's a skill right up there with Academics and Firearms. It should be useful.
Perhaps Occult should be a specialty of Academics? Then again, I'm a fan of games either reducing skill bloat (Savage Worlds) or embracing it (GURPS).
Also I'm firmly in the "a success is a success, and a high Occult just makes a success more likely". Does this mean that the rank novice with Occult 1 can know stuff the Occult 4 character doesn't? Yes. Just like the guy with Firearms 1 can hit something the guy with Firearms 4 misses. But just as Firearms 4 doesn't magically let you use AK-47s, neither does Occult 4 measure the level at which you magically know Daeva from Ventrue. You get more dice, making you more likely to succeed, and that's bonus enough in my book.
That said part of the problem I'm seeing with Occult is that the WoD is filled with bizarro monsters and things, and having one skill be the end-all-be-all of knowledge seems to kind of gross. Want to know about Vampire clans? Roll Occult. Mage Watchtowers? Occult. Werewolf STDs? Occult. Abyssal manifestations of mathematics? Occult. Promethean reproductive failures? Occult. I'd hate to see the WoD mechanics go towards skill bloat for one aspect of the game, but Occult really does seem to be a grossly overpowered skill (and Academics is possibly worse, in a clever player's hands).
Edit: It occurs to me you could simply create Merits for things like Vampire Lore or Werewolf Lore, which would give a bonus to relevant Occult rolls. Default Occult would still be valuable for covering broad types of knowledge ("Iron repels faeries. Almost all vampires can cross running water. Werewolves exhibit weird, shamanistic powers.") but it wouldn't let you know that there's a Left-handed path of mages that serve the Abyss with temporal manipulations. You'd need a Mage Lore or Abyss Lore Merit to even have a chance at knowing (and rolling for) such knowledge.
Double Edit: Merits would probably make more sense as Skill Specialties. D'oh.
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