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OK a thread about magic.

I was thinking and then talking with a few guys at the Castle the other day and the question came up. What is a good, magical effect for stand up? The follow up question is what the would be so strong as to make a good closing effect?

This applies to parlor or stand up, not close up. We were able to think of many "wow" close up effects, but not many stand up.

It seems most of what we could think of were more comedy based rather than magic based.

So to get the ball rolling and get them out of the way, let's toss out animal/bird productions/vanishes and card manipulations.

So what have you got out there?

I think a well timed Rope Through Body is very Magical. NewsFlash is strong Magic as well. Silk Cascade and Spelling Bee can be Magical.

I'm still looking for a great closer after 30 years. I have a couple of closers but I'm not totally satisfied.

A million guys end with Snowstorm. Tons of people end with the Cups and Balls.

However in stand up / platform style magic it's not necessarily the effect, but the presentation. If you have the personality to "sell" a trick onstage you can close with anything.

For example I'd never want to follow Bob Cassidy after he does the thing where he memorizes a deck of cards . Honestly in it's bare bones it's horribly boring. The effect is that you memorize a deck of cards and recall them. In most performers hands it's be an effective replacement for Ambien, but in Cassidy's hands it's a riviting 10 minutes!

There will be a ton of ideas hitting this thread soon I would say. Each performer should have their own requirement for a good stand up piece. For me the requirement are the following for my stand up show.

1. Packs flat and I can carry everything in one case.
2. No props that scream magic trick, everything has to look and feel organic for my stand up show.
3. Able to be seen up close and far away.

Those are my top three requirements. Now for the effects that fill those requirements.
1. Silk to Egg
2. Half Died Silk – Levant’s or Billie’s
3. Awakening
4. Cut Re-cut and Cut again ropes
5. Five Card Opener
6. My Movie Time routine
7. My Rubber Chicken Routine
8. My version of Mugged
9. No Tear News Paper Tear

Not in that order
As for closer, my favorite for that is the world’s tinniest illusion – Gypsy Thread.

No one said it would be easy, or did they?

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This is a good question, but a little open-ended I think.

For what type of audience and in what venue)s) do you anticipate performing for. Makes a BIG differnce.

Mindreading Goose, Confessions of a Needle Swallower, Lemon Trick, Tossed Deck, Confabulation, Himber Ring, Gypsy Thread.

Actually, I am not sure that the type of show is so important unless you were talking about a kid or adult (blue) show. But, for the sake of this exercise, say a family show. Mixed age audience. I was unclear of the size, so 60-100 people at 10 round tables, or equivalent. Small 1 or 2 step platform or possibly on the same level.

I see a number of people have said Gypsy thread. Personally, I find that trick to be too small for platform or stage. I know you can do it, I just don't know you should. The cool principle of that trick is the fair and open handling, similar to the torn cigarette paper. I also feel standard sized cups and balls, even the jumbo size truth be told, are also too small to be fully appreciated from that distance. This is why I fully support the "size to be seen" comment above.

I didn't specifically specify, but I separate mentalism from magic.

Ok. Thank You. that clears things up a bit. you will need a closer than can be SEEN by EVERYONE in the room. in my experience, a FUN closer that's memorable, packs small and plays big is the Jumbo McCombical Prediction trick.

GREAT closer, in my experience, IF you have not allready done a card bit in your show.

Alain Choquette from Canada prooved in an excellent way, thanks to Gary Ouellet, that you can present the Gypsy Thread as a show closer, even though it's a very small effect. He always got a standing ovation for it.
Me too, I use it as a closer in my parlour cabaret show for around a 100 people and without a video screen. The audience gets nuts at the end of it.
If I was ever to change my show closer, than I would exchange it against the T & R cigarette paper.

Show closers that work:

Multiplying Bottles
Duke's Dye Version
Hydrostatic Glass

As for the comments of Cups and such on stage. After seeing Paul Daniels from England perform Chop Cup on a stage for over 1000 people audience, I must say it really depends on the performer.

There are many closers, it all depends on your ability and style. The above mentioned 3 items were for a patter act, but there were no requirements if you wish to close with music. This opens a new range of exciting magic effects.

Like the Phantom Tube, or Genii Tube silk production, Square Circle, etc. These fast and furious productions can close a show in a big way. When using such silks as the 'The End' Silk, it can be used even with a shorter production with patter appropriately worded.

I don't think you can solely lay the work all on the trick, it takes the performer to inject his ideas into the trick and effect, to form it how he wants for his purposes. That is why a trick reqires a performer, if it didn't then anyone could do a magic trick, and as we all know, that is not the case.

Even self working tricks can be miracles in one magicians hands and a 'so what' in anothers.

When I do Gypsy Thread, I use a black light and glow in the dark thread. The mood of the effect when done like this is outstanding.
And it can be seen from a far without cameras. The last show I did the thread for was about 250 people and even the people in the back commented to me on how special they felt that trick was to them. This is the key to a good closer, make it special.

No one said it would be easy, or did they?

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I think you are reading too much into my trick selection. I know it is up to the performer to eck out all he can of a trick. I have seen Paul Daniels and I guess yours and my tastes differ.

No matter who the performed, the audience still need to be able to see the trick to appreciate it. Reminds me of the old cartoon of two guys in a balcony seat and one is looking down at the stage and telling the other, "He just produced another thimble."

I think the Gypsy thread is a great trick. I just don't think it carries as well on stage or platform as it does close up. Let's not debate the merits of that, in this thread. Those who are happy with it, I won't change and vice versa.

Isn't that comedy bit, or do I have the wrong trick in mind? Trying to keep to the framework in the OP, if I can.

On 2011-01-30 15:30, KirkG wrote:
OK a thread about magic.

What is a good, magical effect for stand up? The follow up question is what the would be so strong as to make a good closing effect?

So to get the ball rolling and get them out of the way, let's toss out animal/bird productions/vanishes and card manipulations.

So what have you got out there?

The above is your original post, these were your questions. Actually you did not list effects, but general topics. So general that these topics are not considered "WOW" effects. I have seen many poor animal/bird productions/vanishes and card manipulations at many magic conventions and YouTube videos.

You must have been influenced by being at the Magic Castle where the best of the best is seen.

So, I take it you have not expressed your point very clearly.

If we go by your topics, then this lists is what you are looking for possibly.

Boxes
Tubes
Rope
Necktie
Pans
Cages
Pitchers
Frames
Bottles
Bowling Pins
Bowling Balls

All these have the "WOW" feature.

You are absolutely correct that there are not many WOW ticks in stand up like there are in Close up magic.

I did not consider your general list as most of them are rather small props. In magic the least likely advancement in magic has been in the medium size stage magic. I think the most recent prop trick in the last 50 years is the probably Dean's Box.

I am definitely influenced by the incredible magic I get to see at the Castle on a weekly basis. So I am a bit jaded. But I thought my OP was pretty clear on effects, by which I meant tricks in the standard parlance of the art. I like the milk pitcher, but unless it is paired with a funnel and foo can, it isn't all that impressive by itself. Even then it gets played for comedy. I am looking for strong magical effect in a trick. One example we came up with last night was the Serpentine Silk and the series of effects you can do with it.

Dean's Box is a great trick, but too small for this application. And you are right, I think there has been very little advancement in this form of magic.

Not sure what you are referencing as my general list. I haven't listed anything other than to start the list to remove the animals. Anytime you do a clean live animal production, especially one not expected, it is magic to an audience.

It's nice to be on a fishing expedition, I understand that.

I also understand that there are MANY seasoned and experienced magicians with years of practical performing experience who have learned how to routine acts and performances "the hard way" who are trying to be helpful to you by responding to your question here.

One of the all-time greats, and a regular at the Castle was the late Billy McComb. If Billy McComb were alive today, you could ask him this same question to see what his response would be.

Having said that, in all due respect, I stand by my post above.

Billy and I discussed magic a few times. I never asked this particular question. A truly great performer, but way more based in comedy that mystery.

Fishing? Perhaps. I think of it more as a way to begin a discussion of not just the tricks, but the relative merits and perhaps that will drive a development of routines that focus more on the magic and mystery than comedy. Not all movies have to be musicals, and not all magic acts have to be comedy.

On 2011-02-01 11:51, KirkG wrote:
routines that focus more on the magic and mystery than comedy. Not all movies have to be musicals, and not all magic acts have to be comedy.

But if you want to work for lay audiences, comedy will keep you working. Magic and Mystery will not, as a single act outside of the entertainment cities.

I don't know if you noticed, but even good comedy acts usually put in one good mystifying effect that works. If you listen to the audience they always respond as amazed. Comedy club magicians, do hank through microphone. The audiences are stunned. Then the Café lights up with how do I get the silk through pole questions. Once they find out it requires multiple purchases, practice, and over $100 in props they saidly disappear.

Please do not misunderstand. I am fully aware the need to have good presentation. However, I don't think it all needs to be comedy, hence the movie reference above.

As an example of someone who was quite popular, and not funny, is Uri Geller. While I don't want to follow his path, I wonder if a strong mystery approach is viable.

Comedy is the easy way out. This is not to say good comedy is easy. We have all seen the hacks, tripping over their equipment and saying all the canned lines. Much easy to do that presentation than do a dramatic reading that moves people.

While I have seen good comedy magicians put in a "trick that works" the magic is totally dwarfed by the comedy. I think most audiences forget about the "magic" element. More research into this is needed, by me.

I think the Gypsy thread is a great trick. I just don't think it carries as well on stage or platform as it does close up. Let's not debate the merits of that, in this thread. Those who are happy with it, I won't change and vice versa.

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